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Tuesday, Jul 7, 2009

Many people say that video games will never be art. Personally, I think that is a load of rubbish, and games already demostrate a level of artistic expression vastly above most 'old school' artists, its just that the detractors cannot see that it is a different type of art. Some people also say that emotion cannot be delievered well in games or at least not in the same way as movies, and it is this that I am going to discuss because I am torn between the two sides of that arguement.

You see on one hand you have memorable gaming events like the death of Aeris or the majority of Mass Effect, ones that tug at your heart strings in one way or another or provide a gripping story throughout. But movies do this better for one reason and one reason alone: Actors.

Both games and movies use actors, in games it is for voice and sometimes motion capture, while movies use the actual person in a live way. While anyone who read my last blog will know I believe that games can convey some the best tales ever created, one area that really lets them down is voice acting.

I have recently played and completed Ghostbusters: The Videogame, and once I had I then watched the Blu-Ray of the first film I got with it and I noticed something, something that prompted this post. That something was Bill Murray. Now we all know he is a great actor (Lost in Translation not withstanding) but his performance of the same character in a game and in a movie is telling of why movies, to me, will always be that little bit better (but not more creative).

The animation of a videogame, while widely superior to anything that has come before it at the present time, is still unable to create a truely photorealistic human. This is mostly due to the small movements and twitching a human does, games simply cannot replicate to produce a truely believable human being. This became apparent because I was laughing at Bill Murray's lines in the film but not that much in the game.

Its an interesting point, because actors are being used more and more in games, with some significant voice talent being brought in for major games. The best the medium has to offer, games like Mass Effect or Alpha Protocol do this and do it well, but the cinematic human interaction feel they are going for always feels a little flat, and another reason for this is fluidity.

If were to actually pay attention to the way people talk to each other, you will see there is a fluidity to, one is saying something while the other is thinking what to say in response and continues pretty much as soon as the other person has finished. While I do not deny the best the medium has to offer do a fairly decent job of replicating this, it still falls wide of the mark due to how voice acting is recorded.

Again this is the fault of the medium, as voice acting isnt recorded using the voice actors being in the same room (generally), instead each actor records thier lines and then an editor splices them all together to create the conversation. I am not denying that the method works, but it rarely replicates the true fludity of a conversation as you can hear where is line is stopped and the next started, with very few interuptions or talking over another person.

Now this can have great results, but it depends no what your trying to do. In Ghostbusters, it didnt work because the animation couldnt replicate Bill Murray's ability to conduct himself, and his quick witted lines do not transfer well to the gaming medium. In something like Halo for example, it works because the tone is more serious and comedy is at a minium, letting the voice acting convey what is required well.

I guess its what your trying to accomplish that ultimatly affects what you need to be able to do with voice acting and animation as Ghostbusters was trying to be the third film in the series, though it was a good game, it was still a game and simply couldnt compete on the level the actual movies can. Halo, conversely, is a game through and through, and emulates movie action and science fiction but knows exactly what it is.

So what is the one valid reason why games will never replace movies? Actors plain and simple. Until some figures how to truely make an interactive movie, combining the best of both mediums so that photorealistic actors (or even actual actors) can be used and still give the player all those bad ass powers gamers want then movies are always going to be the superior way to show off subtle acting and get that 'real' feel.

As I have said, I am not having a real pop at gaming, this is just an exploration of a limitation of it. My previous blog showed that I believe games can provide experiences that surpass even the best movies, and I stick by that, but that comes with a certain suspension of disbelief about the way characters have converstations in games.

What do you think?

Category: Editorial
Posted by danny_dm_moore, 8:26am
269 Comments | Post a Comment

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I disagree. Personally, if you take the time to look at movies from say Pixar, which are completely animated, you can see how realistic they are, from animation to voice. Sure, in videogames its different, and they might not have as much money as Pixar does, but if they really took the time and the money to make it look real, it would be damn near the performances given by real actors in real movies. And games, even for me, have not yet replaced movies. But movies have been around for so long, and games are so young. Give it some time, and maybe your children or grand children will tell you, in a very near future, how games have surpassed movies in every way. By the way, great read!
Posted Jul 7, 2009 8:52 am PT
To each his/her own. There's something to be enjoyed (if it's your bag) from each. 3-d Movies won't replace the traditional format. Movies won't replace books. The internet won't replace TV. The list can go on.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 8:59 am PT
Then will animated movies ever replace movies in general? Will animated movies always be second rate? Have you played Wing Commander III or IV or Privateer 2? They had real actors and it helped a lot. Why not, now that we have huge budgets anyhow, go back to such a format and get real actors instead of cheesing them with animation? I think the absence of actors is a moot point. A game with the right budget, and done well, with real actors is possible. Studios are just too cheap to use them if the story requires it.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 9:12 am PT
I never heard of statements that suggested one will replace another. They are often used to compare and contrast as entertainment medium, battling for your spending money. Not replacing one or the other
Posted Jul 7, 2009 9:15 am PT
I must admit no game has ever made me shed a tear, although Aeris' death in FF7 got very near, and so did FFX's ending.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 9:17 am PT
Interesting topic, I think the fundamental difference between films and games in terms of actors/characters is that in films people identify with the actors, an audience will watch a film because it has got an actor/actress in it that they enjoy watching regardless if which character they play. In games the actor is irrelevant; the fact that the same voice actor brought the new Prince of Persia, Nathan Drake (Uncharted) and desmond whatshisname (Assassins Creed) to life goes unnoticed (on a whole). With films success is more often carried forward with actors but in games success can be carried forward in sequels with the same characters tagging along. For example a new Johnny Depp film, e.g Public Enemies has more critical success than the second or third Pirates of the Caribbean whereas Assassins Creed 2 will (hopefully) have more critical success than Prince of Persia. Which may just reinforce that gameplay is more important than characters anyways, i digest.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 9:24 am PT
First things first, this was a good read. Some people prefer games some prefer movies. As long as we have options and we have people with diverse preferences, games will not replace movies, movies wont replace books, etc. Some people prefer to read for example Harry potter books or twilight series, rather than see the movie because the book is more in depth and movies dont tend to do the books any justice. Some people prefer to watch it in 2-3 hours instead of reading the book. Same goes for games, to me games is like a good book, when you get into it you just dont want to pull yourself away. Games is a form of entertainment, as are movies. Games are here to stay, which is what matters. Gamers shall never disappear. sorry i think i went a little off topic with the books and movies.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 9:26 am PT
The "uncanny valley" is a hurdle that is yet to have been overcome.. The true captivation of emotion to the audience will not be achieved till then. Although this would be a major breakthrough, my hope that technology will eventually be improved to the point that the characters are literally the actors we are speaking of. Their movements are cataloged and the movie is "acted" and the film is taped in such a way that we are able to control the action. I.E. instead of Fallout interactions being between a computer rendered character (although they are very realistic for today's technology) can you imagine having a living breathing actor conveying each option in the appropriate emotion coinciding to your approach to that character.

This will be a momentus leap forward and technology just isn't there.. The budget for such a thing would be tremendous. You'd basically be filming the movie/game in so many diff times to get each response that you could get by control in the game.. One day, maybe we'll be there. and then there's the issue of over realism.. being, do you really want a violent video game where when someone gets their leg torn off in a war game, that it will literally be photo realistic, I don't believe it would be that great of an idea.. we are already so immune to violence it's nuts. I'm a gamer myself and I play GoW/FO3 etc.. but I have seen real life violence/gore and it's not something you really want to see... (Iraq vet in case your wondering)
Posted Jul 7, 2009 9:42 am PT
I am sorry to say that this post is not only poorly written, but utterly pointless. Video games will never replace movies, much like sitcoms never replaced trashy rag magazines. I am a huge fan of video games myself, but movies serve a completely different purpose than video games. I like being able to sit down and watch a movie without worrying over the outcome of my actions during it. The question of whether video games will replace movies has an easy answer; no.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 9:49 am PT
I don't think that photo-realism is what makes a story good. For example, I think the reason a stylized games like Okami or Shadow of the Colossus have good stories is because their graphics weren't photo-realistic.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 10:02 am PT
they shouldnt replace them though. just be respected as the same level of entertainment and qulity.

Just as movies shouldnt be thought of as replacing the stage.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 10:04 am PT
You made some interesting points. Games will never replace movies - they are two different forms of entertainment. One is interactive and more action-driven, and one is passive where you are drawn in by the actor's ability as well as the story being told. Both have the ability to tell a story and it will interesting to see how far games will go in that regard.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 10:14 am PT
Interesting read, but I don't think that video games will replace movies either, because the both of them are different experiences. The reason why I would play a game is different from the reason I would watch a movie (which I don't do alot anymore...). Video games excel at certain factors over movies, while movies excel at certain factors over games. I don't think we will ever see a day where movies are replaced by games, or games replaced by movies, because many different people will do either for different reasons; each industry will always have it's fans.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 10:22 am PT
There's one thing video games have more of than the current generation of movies, and that's good directors.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 10:30 am PT
I do agree that video games can't replace movies, but that doesn't mean that video games are inferior. They're just two different things. Excellent read, by the way - your opinion is very well put.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 10:44 am PT
Yeah, I have thoughts on that as well.

Games should not try to be interactive movies. I think it is a very limiting way to define a video game. Video games are interactive media, but not necessarily movies. There is a big difference between those two concepts.

Sure, games can tell stories and do a great job of it, but to tell a story with pre-rendered cut-scenes and voice actors is not the most creative way to go about it. As you said, a game cannot be as good as a movie if it is trying to be nothing more than an interactive movie.

It could be interesting to let the gamer imagine the story as the gameplay unfolds. For example, in Metroid Prime the gamer is thrust into a living and breathing universe and is free to explore it. The story is not told by cut-scenes or voice actors and the text that is there to be read is not mandatory. If you don't feel like reading anything, you don't have to. The adventures you experience and the things you see define the story. The environments and the gameplay events are what the game uses to convey emotions or ideas to you.

Not many games do this, but those that manage to do it well are remembered.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 10:48 am PT
There are some gems out there and I say that games are art forms. I think it is unfair to compare games too closely to movies and expect them to have the same features. We wouldn't compare music to movies in the same way.

That said, the problem working against games to be artistic masterpieces compared to movies is the scope of the project at hand and how new the medium is. It seems to me larger crews and more time and more money are typical of the more audacious games and needing more resources makes the games less economical. Some of the best movies have very independent roots and are the vision of a single person. I think with time more people who have worked in the industry for a long time will begin to have enough create control to bring about games that are artistically profound. Hideo Kojima is a great example.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 10:55 am PT
I don't think video games will ever replace movies for the fact that movies are more relaxing than video games. You can't relax as much as you could while watching movie as you would playing a video game.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 11:02 am PT
I agree with what you're saying about games being unable to replicate the precise body movements of a real actor, but I think that in the near future they will get there. Look at how far games have come over the past 10 years, just imagine what we can achieve next.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 11:27 am PT
I think the untitled motive of this editorial is to question if games can ever move us as much as movies. From a visual point of view, facial expressions and body language of great actors cannot be replicated via CGI (at least not yet... just look at how horrible CGI Arnold was in the latest Terminator). But coming up with novelty can sometimes lead to positive results, as in the tech demo for Heavy Rain.

However, leaning on voice acting as somehow being inferior to live action is a precarious argument. I would say that any form of entertainment that has a script (movies, tv, cutscenes in games) is primarily carried by that script. After that, voice acting needs to be done well to convey the emotions of the script. Bruce Campbell did excellent voice acting in Tachyon: The Fringe, probably because the script was written around his type of character. More recently, Heavenly Sword did a great job of voice acting and animating the characters.

I think it only seems like games aren't very good at conveying meaning because for one, most games aren't developed for that purpose. Most of the time, they are supposed to be fun, interactive wastes of time. For the games that do try to provide an emotional story, I would say that there are just as many good types of these games as there are good movies.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 11:33 am PT
what I've seen most from games is that they are trying to be action movies, and that is why they work. Games definately have the potential to be very emotional and heart-wrenching. The question is, will it still be fun to play. While pixar made an emotional UP, the transfer to a fun game is impossible. The real limitation in games is not the acting as much as the idea itself.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 11:44 am PT
"This is mostly due to the small movements and twitching a human does, games simply cannot replicate to produce a truely believable human being."

Yet.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 11:49 am PT
Could people stop bringing up Aeris' death at every possible oppurtunity? Speaking from personal experience, knowing about it in advance makes it much, much less moving. If you mentioned 'the end of disc 1 of Final Fantasy VII', everyone who'd played it would know what you mean. In that respect, games are like movies - take that line at the end of Empire Strikes Back, for example.
Incidentally, that didn't need voice actors and everyone still cites it as being very emotional.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 12:27 pm PT
onething77 hit on the exact thing I was going to say before reading his post - Pixar and Dreamworks.... they both manage to release films at an animation level that is absolutely believable in terms of making you feel for the character. All the little facial gestures and nuances of people have been captured in these films for at least a decade now.... hell, they can make you believe a fish can talk for real (finding Nemo) or even a silent, wordless little robot (wall-e in the first half of the film barely uttered a bleep) can convey more emotion than any of their films before it...

I think if we were going to say anything on the subject, it would be that current hardware and budget constraints mean we won't see games blurring the line between the two enough to make one single genre anytime soon in our homes.

But never say never - if there's one thing you can count on, it's progress. Progress that makes anything possible that was impossible previously.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 12:50 pm PT
I don't know about that. I think one of the best selections of film available is the Futurama series and it's strongest points are the execution and delivery of it's comedic lines. I bring this up because, as a cartoon, Futurama should have the same difficulties as a video game. What I actually observe, however, is that the cartoon nature of Futurama lets the very talented artists, voice actors and editing crew home in on the exactly desired effect whereas with actors, you have to deal with all the other emotion they show. I would suggest that the blockiness of some of the dialogue in Mass Effect is a result of less than top-notch voice directing and editing. I would guess the same for Ghostbusters but I haven't played it.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 1:08 pm PT
I think that the question isn't if games will ever surpass movies, because let's face it they won't. What I wonder is with out all the bells and whistles movies have if people will ever admit that video games can produce the same kind story and emotion that movies can.
A great example is the recent Spider-Man movies overall success, if you remember before Hollywood came in too play it was labeled by most of society as a geeky comic book.
This is my two cents. By the way, good article.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 2:02 pm PT
@ necronaux well thats all that really needed to be said on the subject case closed lol.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 2:21 pm PT
Well, I agree with you- that we can never actually replicate in video games the art of acting we see in movies- but you don't need a whole page to prove it. There are over 600 muscles in the human body (skeletal muscles) that contract to match our physical expressions. It's a complex system that will probably never be replicated in video games characters as seen in actual human actors. There is simply not the motion capture technology available to replicate this in video games. Maybe one day...

Good entry, I enjoyed the read
Posted Jul 7, 2009 2:54 pm PT
For me gaming and cinema are two things that I love but I believe that they are different in what they try to achieve. If I want to see people acting I'll watch a movie. Gaming, for me, stimulates different portions of my brain....I always compared gaming to painting more than I compared it to movies. Ultimately, I believe gaming must be established as a new form of art altogether.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 3:00 pm PT
I think someday video games and movies will merge.When virtual reality because more like reality, people will be able to tell stories in true first person fashion.

Not to sound super nerdy, but I envision something like Star Trek's holodeck. The movies of today would be like holo novels, and the video games of today would be more like the simulators. This would be the ultimate immersive experience. While I doubt anything that advanced would happen in my lifetime, I bet virtual reality would advance enough to become another viable option for media hardware.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 3:14 pm PT
nooooooooo! AERITH!!!
Posted Jul 7, 2009 4:15 pm PT
and FFVII: Crisis Core also came near some tears.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 4:15 pm PT
i think that you're very wrong on a fundamental level, but very right on another.

you're wrong, because games do have actors. the actors are us! we are the life and the fluidity and the spontaneous element; the intention and the expresion.

you're right because games are essentially not movies, by definition (they don't use the same materials or technology). so they can never totally emulate movies in exactly the same way. but what is the point of doing that anyway?

in my opinion games are art. they're art in lots of different ways. i can explain this in a literal sense and compare games to 'installation art', 'performance art', 'conceptual art', 'oil paintings', 'sculpture', 'process art', and probably more besides. those are documented evidence of art movements that games fit in with, albeit somewhat 'unofficially'.

and games are art because they involve the player in a dialogue of interpretation and creativity. the game product isn't art though. the experience is the art if you want to call it that, that's where it most applies.

i don't think all games are by definition, matter of factly 'Art' though.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 4:25 pm PT
AERIS DIES!!!!???

wtf spoiler much?
Posted Jul 7, 2009 4:27 pm PT
A great movie requires a great story and cinematography as well as talented actors. I mean great actors won't save a movie if the story and/or cinematography sucks. Video gaming compensates the acting and dialogue limitations by allowing the player to influence the unfolding and outcome of the story's events. In well designed video games player is able to connect to the story to the extent the limited acting and dialogue don't matter. For example, I felt great sorrow at Uncas' death in Last of the Mohicans. I felt the same in Fallout 3 when I had to "murder" an innocent female ghoul in order to complete the Tenpenny Tower quest. For the foreseable future movies and video games will continue to entertain us but they'll just do it differently.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 4:51 pm PT
the game industry for the past 2 years has been out selling the movie industry and music.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 5:09 pm PT
theirs only one game that I shed a tear on and it was metal gear soild 3 snake eater when they where telling why boss switch sides. It was so mess up and sad what the US goverment did to her. and snake had to kill her the person who trained him and taught him every thing
Posted Jul 7, 2009 5:18 pm PT
One thing for the graphics issues.. That is it hard to make a moving fully controllable game graphics than a movie graphics.. It means even in the future that the game have a Graphics as much as the movie, movie graphics is still great but it is not movable
Posted Jul 7, 2009 5:49 pm PT
I completely agree with this post. At least at this very moment. The "Meet Emily - Image Metrics Tech Demo" I saw on Youtube.com a while back, really showed some promise. And its not just money that keeps games from looking like Pixar films. You gotta understand that Pixar doesn't have to compromise. They don't have to fit their work on a game disc, or worry about controls, or stuff rendering in real time. This gives Pixar or any other CG animation studio the ability to create a world with realistic emotions and performances. The only other reason I can think of, is the sad fact that the really talented actors don't take this medium seriously. I'm just waiting for the day I play a game, and then get the desire to check IMDB to see what actor played the main character.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 7:11 pm PT
i think that is a pretty easy thing to argue. of course video games won't replace movies.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 7:50 pm PT
A movie that corroborates your statement would be the 3D p.o.s Beowulf. They used real actors for voice acting and mo-cap and that movie was horrible for the reasons you stated. The characters come off as creepy rather then realistic since they cannot convey emotion in quite the same way as human actors can. But its also interesting that some Pixar, Dreamworks and Disney movies can convey extremely strong emotions with completely unrealistic characters like those found in Toy Story or Kung Fu Panda or even Bambi (dont lie when you were a little kid you cried like a little girl when his mom got shot). It all has to do with the performers, the director(s) and most importantly the story. No video game has ever come close to the emotional connection that is created by my favorite movies. What video game has ever gripped you as much as say Full Metal Jacket or The Killing Fields or even Star Wars. Has any video game come even close to how you felt the first time you saw Darth Vader emerge into a white smoke filled hallway staring down at the dead bodies of his troopers as if they were mere toys? NEVER! There is no death scene in Final Fantasy that can even hold a candle to the fantastic ones that can be found in movies. Fredo at the end of Godfather 2, Yoda and Obi-Wan in Star Wars, any of the children you see die in the Killing Fields or the little girl in the red dress from Schindler's List, Private Pyle shooting himself in Full Metal Jacket the list goes on and on.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 8:10 pm PT
Someone really thought videogames would replace movies?
Posted Jul 7, 2009 8:57 pm PT
There is way more than one valid reason why games won't replace movies. They both offer different experiences and shouldn't really be compared.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 8:57 pm PT
You are compairing movies with games with the same title , then you should go for tomb raider which is better as a game , also Resident Evil . And there is metal gear solid it has one of the best story mod , I'm not a mgs fanboy , but that game really makes you live the story !!! .
Posted Jul 7, 2009 11:05 pm PT
That's a good point about the pixar movies, onething77.

As has been said, it was an interesting read. I do think movies and video games are becoming more and more intertwined in our perceptions, but I think it's precisely because games really are becoming more sophisticated all the time. Technical missteps aside, many games nowadays have solid voice acting, and although they sometimes lack some of the mellon collie that movies deliver with acting, with the emotional impact of games like ICO, the Final Fantasy series, the Max Payne series, the intensity of games like the Resident Evil series, Bioshock, The Metal Gear series, the charm and humor of the Disgaea series, The Lego series, the Katamari series,I dunno what more one could ask for on an emotional level.

I don't really know if games are destined to replace movies in any capacity, but I have trouble believing that the world will be forever ignorant of the unique (and superior, in my opinion) artistry and heart that it takes to make a great game.
Posted Jul 7, 2009 11:22 pm PT
Ok, i have to say something to those of you taking about the pixar movies. Not one of those movies is trying to create realistic human. They convey emotion well, yes, I agree but it is an exaggerated set of facial animations which are more like cartoons then anything else, which works. The cut scenes i have seen for Brutal Legend do the same, they are not trying to convey an actual human, they know what they are and play to it, games like ghostbusters than aim to be like the movies that inspired them cannot compete because the technology simply isnt there.
Posted Jul 8, 2009 1:55 am PT
I don't think games will ever replace movies. But, not for your reason. For a different one entirely: Laziness. Games take effort, they take contribution, when you're tired or just not feeling up to doing something hands on you can pop in a blu-ray and let you mind wander.
Posted Jul 8, 2009 2:32 am PT
A rebound rant.

http://www.gamespot.com/users/DKant/show_blog_entry.php?topic_id=m-100-25697794&tag=all-about;blog1
Posted Jul 8, 2009 3:05 am PT
Games will never replace movies becausse they are two different things. Putting actors (real people) in games could only work for some kinds of games. Take Halo, for instance. Would you cast a bunch of midgets to play the grunts, in grunt suits? Probably not. You'd probably use CG. Games like Red Alert work, because the briefings and cut scenes are mostly live action. The game itself is all CG.

I wish conversations in some games could be better, though. Like in Oblivion. In the conversations the NPCs are all voiced, they express emotions. However, the PC is silent. He or she has no spoken lines, no emotion. You have to read them yourself, and give them emotion. I'd like a game where you don't just pick what your character looks like, you also get to choose their voice and hear them say their lines in the game.
Posted Jul 8, 2009 6:47 am PT
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